Category: Fundamentalism

General critiques (and discussions) of fundamentalism (IFB or IFBx)

Gone for the Weekend

~ fundyreformed ~ 3 Comments

Hi! Thanks for reading my blog, even when I am slow to post. I went fishing today, and will leave for a wedding this weekend. I won’t get back to posting in earnest until Tuesday, probably.

Until then, you might want to check out this site that I’ve been meaning to promote for some time now. IFBReformation.Org. Check out his Origins of Independent Fundamental Baptists. It is quite interesting. Spend some time on his site, and check back here Tuesday.

Blessings because of Jesus’ Cross,

Bob Hayton

Sam Storms on Traditionalism, Fundamentalism, Unity, and More

~ fundyreformed ~ 5 Comments

Recently, I read a fascinating interview of Sam Storms  concerning an upcoming Baptist Conference on the Holy Spirit, which Sam will be speaking at. Sam Storms is best known for his non-cessationist position on miraculous gifts (learn more at his website EnjoyingGodMinistries.Com). However, he is also an advocate of conservative Biblical theology, Calvinism, complementarianism, and the centrality of the Word in worship. He’s also a Dallas Seminary grad, so as you can see, Dr. Sam Storms is an interesting person to interview.

The interview did not just focus on spiritual gifts, however. Since the conference is being hosted by a prominent Southern Baptist church, the interview (conducted by 12 Witnesses) asked Storms what he thought about the current issues facing the SBC. In his responses, he touched on issues central to the purpose of this blog. He touched on problems with fundamentalism and traditionalism, and the need for unity. So I thought I would reproduce some of his comments here for my readers, and encourage them to check out the interesting and informative full interview over at 12 Witnesses.

Question: Within the Southern Baptist landscape right now, what issues do you see driving our mutual discussion? Is there an overarching issue that relates to all of the things abuzz in the Convention? If so, what is it?

Answer: The issues are much the same as they’ve been for generations. The things Christians disagree and argue about are fairly constant: the sovereignty of God and human responsibility, especially as it relates to evangelism and missions; the role of the Holy Spirit and spiritual gifts in particular; the role of women in ministry and leadership; eschatology, spontaneity vs. liturgy in worship, etc. These and a few other issues are almost always at the center of debate, not just among Baptists but across denominational lines.

The one thing these issues have in common is that none of them is central to the gospel itself. They are all, at best, secondary doctrines, or doctrines on which Christ-exalting, Bible-believing Christians can and often do disagree. Sadly, some question the evangelical credentials of anyone who might dare to differ with their view on Calvinism or whether miraculous gifts occur today or the timing of the rapture or the nature of the millennium.

But there is something else that is even more disturbing, and that is the angry and divisive dogmatism that is emerging over behavioral issues on which the Bible is either silent or leaves one’s decision in the realm of Christian freedom. Perhaps the greatest threat to unity and acceptance in the Church is the tendency to treat particular life-style and cultural preferences as though they were divine law. To be even more specific, it’s the tendency to constrict or reduce or narrow the boundaries of what is acceptable to God, either by demanding what the Bible doesn’t require or forbidding what the Bible clearly permits.

My experience has been that this is typically driven by one of three things: either an unjustified fear of being “spiritually contaminated” by too close contact with the surrounding culture, or an unbridled ambition to gain power over the lives of others, or a failure to believe and trust in the all-sufficiency of Jesus Christ (or all three combined).

I’m concerned that in certain segments of the Convention there is a mindset reminiscent of the old “fundamentalism” that is characterized by isolationism, separatism, anti-intellectualism, cultural withdrawal, and a generally angry and judgmental attitude toward all those who dare to differ on these matters that quite simply don’t matter; at least they don’t matter nearly as much as whether or not you believe in the deity of Christ, his substitutionary atonement, bodily resurrection, and salvation by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone.

Whereas conservative evangelicalism has typically drawn the line on theological essentials, this more recent fundamentalism draws the line ever more narrowly on issues such as total abstinence vs. moderation in the use of alcohol, the degree of freedom and the role of affections in public worship, the legitimacy of so-called “private prayer language,” etc. Sadly, when one’s commitment to Christ and the authority of Scripture is judged on the basis of this latter group of issues, rather than the former, the situation is bleak indeed.

Question: How do you see the debate over moderation concerning the consumption of alcohol? Do you see a disparity in the approach to the alcohol issue and other issues under debate?

Answer: Honestly, I’m weary of this debate. Certainly anyone who embraces the authority of Scripture must denounce drunkenness. But I’ve never been persuaded in the least by the alleged “biblical” arguments for total abstinence. Having said that, I think total abstinence is a perfectly honorable and permissible practice to embrace. Any Christian is free to abstain from alcohol. But they aren’t free, in my opinion, to insist that others do the same. They are even less free to accuse those who drink in moderation of being sub-Christian. Abstinence per se is neither a sign of spiritual weakness nor of spiritual strength. Neither is one’s choice of moderation in the use of alcohol a sign of weakness or strength. Whether one totally abstains or drinks in moderation is simply irrelevant to Christian spirituality.

Question: What are your thoughts on the Traditional church, the Missional church and the Emergent church?

Answer: …My primary concern for the Traditional church is that its customs, rituals (yes, even Southern Baptist’s have rituals; they just don’t call them that), habits, and accepted patterns for ministry and worship are so deeply entrenched in the spiritual psyche of a people that the Bible itself is not allowed to critique what is done or provide direction for new expressions of life as the body of Christ.

There is also the potential threat of a Traditional church losing touch with the surrounding culture. They can often create a “fortress” mentality, circle the wagons, hunker down so to speak, and rarely engage with the developments in society or the unsaved who populate it.

Too often, in the name of tradition, freedom in worship is stifled, the power of the Spirit is suppressed, age old “doctrines” are immune from biblical scrutiny, and what makes people “feel comfortable” is the decisive factor in evaluating fresh proposals or efforts to reach the lost and more effectively communicate with the saved… [note he does go on to criticize the Emergent church as well]

Emphasis was added in the above excerpts. Be sure to read the whole interview. And please let me know if you think Storms is off on some of his assessments here.

Drop Everything…

~ fundyreformed ~ 25 Comments

…and read this post by Ken Fields: “Should I Continue to Embrace the Fundamentalist Label?”!!!

It’s possibly the equal of one of  Phil Johnson‘s critiques on Fundamentalism. Well thought through, carefully worded, and challenging — at the very least this post will cause you to think and evaluate where you stand on this issue.  

My prayer is that it will encourage even more unity within the Body of Christ.

Thanks, Ken!

(Oh yeah, you might be interested in my response to his post. Comment #26 I believe.)

Beware the Big Orange Truck

~ fundyreformed ~ 10 Comments

Most of you have seen the Big Orange Truck. It’s driven by a pastor who goes by ReglerJoe. He is still an Independent Fundamental Baptist, yet he is driving toward reform. He has been learning and studying and growing in his understanding of Scripture.

If he never leaves the IFB movement and if he never wholeheartedly embraces Reformed Theology or any other point I feel strongly on, at the end of the day I really don’t care. I’m just glad he is thinking and growing and studying. (For the record, the solution, for anyone struggling with things  related to  the IFB movement, is not necessarily or even not often, to jump ship.)

But he’s also moving. His blog abandanoed Blogger in favor of WordPress, and having done that myself, I’m sure the move will result in a better blog that’s easier for him to handle. He doesn’t always post every week, but when he posts, its worth your time.

So if you haven’t checked out the Big Orange Truck, please do. In fact, his latest post contains an expanded version of his initial “list” of problems within Independent Baptist Fundamentalism. Many of those problems have been addressed here, and also on his blog. So check out his blog, but beware of that orange truck. It’s big, and it’s barreling down the road and picking up speed!

The Holiness of High Standards

~ fundyreformed

I came across a post today that almost blew my socks off! It is such an important topic, and the post was worded so perfectly. So I thought I should stop everything, and encourage you all to go read this post. Let me  introduce the post more fully, and then I’ll give you the link.

William Dudding, who is a KJV using, Independant Fundamental Baptist, is also a reformer. His blog, The Reforming Baptist, deals with many of the struggles that face fundamentalists. And although we don’t always see eye to eye on every issue, I have tremendous respect for Will. He doesn’t go with the flow, and he respects God’s Word. His posts are often challenging and enriching.

This post is entitled, “High Standards = Right Doctrine“. Let me give you an excerpt from the beginning of the post, and then send you off to read the rest.

I remember growing up as a strict Fundamentalist Baptist that I used to think because we held to such a high standard of living, that we must be the most elite of Christians; the ones most in touch with God; the ones who were the closest to genuine Christianity as God intended it to be.

We would look condescendingly down on another Christian who disagreed with any of our positions whether they be soul winning, the King James Bible, Dispensationalism, etc. The measure of correct doctrine to too many of us in Fundamentalism is the length of a woman’s skirt, or the shortness of a man’s hair.

Isaiah 65:3,5 “A people that provoketh me to anger continually to my face; ….Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou.”

[Read the entire post.]